Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

Ukraine’s Soloway Coffee Opens First US Shop in Chicago

A specialty coffee roasting company based in western Ukraine called Soloway Coffee (Instagram link) this week opened its first location in the United States. Beans roasted in Ternopil, Ukraine, using…


In Tbilisi, Parsek1 Merges Comic Books with Specialty Coffee

We take a look at how this innovative café has changed the face of comics and coffee in the capital of Georgia. BY VASILEIA FANARIOTISENIOR ONLINE CORRESPONDENT Photos courtesy of Parsek1 When it comes to coffee and comic books, Japan is a longtime leader in the field. Manga cafés have been around for decades, combining […]


Exploring the Potential of Drones in Coffee Production 

New drone technology has the potential to revolutionize coffee farming from the air. BY VASILEIA FANARIOTISENIOR ONLINE CORRESPONDENT Cover photo by David Henrichs via Unsplash In an ever-evolving technological landscape, coffee producers have begun turning to drones in an attempt to increase efficiency and operations. These unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) offer a wide range of […]


Pick Your Pourover: Comparing and Contrasting the Most Popular Models

The Hario V60, Kalita Wave, and Chemex are three of the most popular pourover devices. Today, we’re comparing the three to help you determine which is the right choice for you. BY EMILY MENESES BARISTA MAGAZINE ONLINE Featured photo by Julien Labelle via Unsplash Ah, the pourover—this tried-and-true form of brewing is sacred in the […]

Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

Philadelphia’s Café Don Pedro Seeks to Build Up Small Businesses

A Dominican-owned coffee roasting company called Café Don Pedro recently launched in Philadelphia with ambitions for direct trading and boosting more Latino-owned small businesses throughout its supply and distribution networks….


10 (More) Minutes With Helena Oliviero

Today we continue our conversation with Helena Oliviero about her coffee career and life on a Colombian finca. BY TANYA NANETTISENIOR ONLINE CORRESPONDENT Photos courtesy of Helena Oliviero Barista Magazine: Let’s talk about living on a Colombian coffee farm, Finca Palma Roja. How do you spend your days? What’s usually happening on a busy coffee […]


Know Your Sweeteners: Agave: Part One — Indigenous Use

Known today primarily as a sweetener, agave can be traced back thousands of years. BY EMILY JOY MENESESBARISTA MAGAZINE ONLINE Featured photo by Bruno Cervera via Unsplash Recently, we launched our brand new article series “Know Your Sweeteners,” where we’re discussing a variety of sweeteners and syrups, and analyzing the unique characteristics of each one. […]


Design Details: A Petit Le Café Coffee in Midtown Manhattan

Welcome to Design Details, an ongoing editorial feature in Daily Coffee News focused on individual examples of coffee shop architecture, interior design, packaging design or branding. If you are a coffee…

Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

Congrats to the Top-Ranking Qualifiers at U.S. CoffeeChamps Denver

Dozens of coffee professionals competed at qualifiers this weekend in Colorado for coveted spots at the U.S. Coffee Championships next month. BY J. MARIE CARLANBARISTA MAGAZINE ONLINE Cover photo by J. Marie Carlan For competitive coffee professionals in the USA, the U.S. Coffee Championships are the place to be. Over the weekend, the second USCC […]


10 (More) Minutes With Helena Oliviero

Today we continue our conversation with Helena Oliviero about her coffee career and life on a Colombian finca. BY TANYA NANETTISENIOR ONLINE CORRESPONDENT Photos courtesy of Helena Oliviero Barista Magazine: Let’s talk about living on a Colombian coffee farm, Finca Palma Roja. How do you spend your days? What’s usually happening on a busy coffee […]


Study Shines New Light on the Complex Arabica Coffee Genome

Researchers in Italy say they’ve shed new light on arabica coffee’s large and complex genome, which may ultimately help breeders seeking desirable traits such as high quality and disease resistance….


Medium-sized farms play an important role in specialty coffee

For many consumers and industry professionals, specialty coffee and direct trade are inextricably linked. Building strong and mutually beneficial working relationships between producers and roasters is often seen as a cornerstone of establishing a truly sustainable supply chain. So with this association between specialty coffee and direct trade, there can be a narrative of smaller-sized […]

Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

minimum dose size?

Jan 31, 2024 |

I use the Hario switch to brew my coffee and am trying to reduce my caffeine consumption. Hence I would like to brew smaller cups of coffee. I am currently using 10g of coffee with 160g of water. (1:16 Ratio) I am wondering if there is a minimum amount of coffee...

Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

I used to wonder why my coffee was almost always sour. It seems other people have the same problem, so I just want to share my story, my frustration, and my happy discovery.

I'm also curious how other people learned the difference between sour vs stale? And what words you do you use to describe those flavors?

TL;DR- bought a good grinder, bought fresh roasted coffee. Learned that stale sour is different than under extracted sour. Also, old beans stale is different than old grounds stale.

For my home coffee, I used to grind finer and finer and brew hotter and hotter and still have problems with sourness… I was buying grocery store coffee, sometimes preground, and using a cheapo javapresse ceramic burr hand grinder. Also, I'm the only coffee drinker in the house, so it could take weeks or months to use up a bag.

Recently, I learned that what I thought was sour coffee was stale coffee. Under extracted sourness is different. It has a mouth puckering sour feel, not just a sour taste. I'm even thinking that roasted too long ago vs. ground too long ago staleness have different stale flavors.

My timeline of realization went like this: Early December- gifted a bag of roasted in October Intelligentsia beans, put them in the freezer knowing I would get a good grinder soon. Mid December- bought some specialty coffee locally about 5 days after it was roasted. Had the coffee shop grind it for me. I started keeping a journal of tasting notes and brewing methods.

That local coffee tasted a bit harsh for a day or two, then leveled off and was good, then lost its aroma, but tasted okay. This over a week or two. Then I got my 1ZPresso grinder and thawed out the Intelligentsia beans. They were good but just a touch ashy on the finish, if steeped too long. I mostly brewed those for the next couple weeks.

Then I busted the local coffee back out a couple days ago, so it was ground almost a month ago. No aroma to the grounds. Suuuuper sour coffee like I used to always make. Tastes like vegetables. Tastes I don't know, green? Undrinkable. Tossed it all out.

Went back to Intelligentsia, ashy/roasty flavour more evident. Tried a new aeropress recipe with much coarser grind. Totally different! Not as ashy, but…. sour. My mouth felt like I ate sour candy. So that's what sour means!

The beans that were roasted months ago tasted ashy-roasty-sour when fresh ground, the fresh roasted but ground weeks ago coffee tasted plant-sour, and the under extracted coffee tasted (and felt) sour candy sour. Only the last one had the notably different mouthfeel.

Maybe time past roast has more of an effect on purely internal/ time based chemical changes, while time past grinding has more of an effect on just oxidation type changes due to the increased surface area?

I'm starting to experiment and make bad coffee on purpose now. Too hot water, too cold, waaaaay too much coffee, or extreme grind sizes. I hope I learn more about defects this way, and I hope this story helps someone!

submitted by /u/Classy-J
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Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

Perfect Little Beans

Chinmey Hill Coffee uses specialty-grade beans with zero primary defects (such as black beans or sour beans) and less than five secondary defects (such as broken beans). This is important because primary defects will greatly affect the taste of the coffee. Having zero defects allows the coffee to be the most optimal flavor.

Window for Optimal Flavor

Chimney Hill Coffee ships our coffee the same day it was roasted, so you will receive it before it enters the window of optimal flavor.  This means you’ll never miss the opportunity to enjoy the coffee’s peak flavor.

Coffee Ratings

Coffee undergoes many scoring processes by professionals who achieved their Q Grader certification. Coffee is first graded when it’s green. If there are defects the coffee is determined to be “not-specialty grade”. For those coffees that pass green grading, they are sample roasted and cupped. (Cupping is the official term for critically tasting and scoring coffees. The official cupping form is standard worldwide, and where the 100-point scoring system comes from.) A coffee’s dry fragrance, wet aroma, flavor, aftertaste, body, acidity, balance, and overall impression are taken into consideration while uniformity issues and defects, will lower the overall score.

Specialty Coffee

Specialty coffee, coined by Erna Knutsen in 1974, refers to a coffee that receives a quality grading score of 80 percent or higher. While “premium” or “gourmet” seem like they’re synonymous with “specialty,” they simply are marketing terms with no defined standards. Specialty coffees are grown in specific and ideal micro-climates, and have distinctive and unique flavor profiles, with little to no defects.

Third-Wave Coffee

We’re currently in the third wave of coffee. The first wave of American coffee put pre-ground, vacuum-sealed cans in kitchens across America. The second wave started with the late ‘60s introduction of Peet’s coffee (by Alfred Peet) through the proliferation of Starbucks. The third wave of coffee focuses on origin transparency, nuanced flavors, and artisan roasting. The term “third wave” is synonymous with specialty coffee.

Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

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