Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

The Potential of Augmented Reality Technology for the Coffee Industry

Join us as we explore the applications and trends of “augmented reality“ in the world of coffee. BY VASILEIA FANARIOTISENIOR ONLINE CORRESPONDENT Featured photo courtesy of Pixabay In the ever-evolving landscape of technology, augmented reality (AR) has emerged as a transformative force, blurring the lines between the digital and physical worlds. As we step into […]


Brewing at Home and On the Road with Darrin Daniel

We check in with the Cup of Excellence executive director to learn his current coffee-brewing habits. BY TANYA NANETTISENIOR ONLINE CORRESPONDENT Featured photo by Emre…


Know Your Sweeteners: Honey: Part Two

We continue our deep dive into honey, bringing to light environmental and animal rights concerns related to the product, and how the industry is addressing them. BY EMILY JOY MENESESBARISTA MAGAZINE ONLINE Feature photo via Unsplash This week we started our discussion of honey, uncovering how it’s produced, the differences between varieties of honey, and […]


4 Coffee Shops Worth a Visit in Madrid

In recent years, the Spanish capital has developed a vibrant specialty-coffee scene. Here are some cool cafés to visit for a caffeine fuel-up. BY TANYA NANETTISENIOR ONLINE CORRESPONDENT Featured photo by Jorge Fernández Salas via Unsplash The espresso bar at HanSo. HanSo Café, a Perfect Spot for Breakfast   In Chinese, HanSo roughly translates to “a […]

Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

Brewing at Home and On the Road with Darrin Daniel

We check in with the Cup of Excellence executive director to learn his current coffee-brewing habits. BY TANYA NANETTISENIOR ONLINE CORRESPONDENT Featured photo by Emre…


Book Review: From Nerd to Pro, by Patrik Rolf

From Nerd to Pro: A Coffee Journey is an autobiography by roaster, café operator, and coffee competitor Patrik Rolf sharing his coffee journey. BY TANYA NANETTI SENIOR ONLINE CORRESPONDENT Featured photo by Tanya Nanetti I’ve read plenty of books on coffee over the years: manuals on how to brew great coffee at home, books on […]


The Color of Coffee Collective Symposium Returns for Its Second Year

The collective and the nonprofit Koffee with Keith will hold their second annual symposium in Houston on March 10-12. BY J. MARIE CARLANBARISTA MAGAZINE ONLINE Photos courtesy of the Color of Coffee Collective The Color of Coffee Collective (COCC) is an organization that seeks to promote equity and opportunity for people of color in the […]


What I Learned from My First Tea Ceremony

After taking in a brief moment of a tea ceremony in Thailand, I finally had the chance to participate in the full experience recently in Malaysia. BY TANYA NANETTI SENIOR ONLINE CORRESPONDENT Photos by Tanya Nanetti In the years that I worked as a barista in a café, tea always played a marginal role in […]

Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

New AFCA Director Gilbert Gatali on the 20th African Fine Coffees Conference

As the African Fine Coffees Association (AFCA) prepares for the 20th iteration of its flagship event, the African Fine Coffees Conference and Exhibition, the group is operating under new executive…


Coffee News Recap, 20 Jan: Last chance to apply for PRF El Salvador Mayorga Scholarship and volunteer positions, World of Coffee Dubai attracts more than 12,000 visitors & other stories

Every Friday, Perfect Daily Grind rounds up the top coffee industry news from the previous week. Here are this week’s stories. Mon, 16 Jan World of Coffee Dubai 2023 attracts more than 12,000 visitors from 48 countries. The event, which was held at the Dubai World Trade Centre, also included over 180 exhibitors and 36 […]


Ethos Agriculture’s Journey from Vision to Impact in Coffee Sustainability: Part Two

In the second half of this article, we discover how the Coffee Barometer attempts to bridge the gap between discourse and action, envisioning a sustainable…


The coffee industry’s biggest competition: The story of the World Barista Championship

Every year, the global coffee industry gears up for one of its most exciting and groundbreaking competitions: the World Barista Championship. For more than two decades, the WBC has been one of the biggest catalysts for change and innovation in specialty coffee, and continues to set even higher standards for baristas around the world to […]

Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

minimum dose size?

Jan 31, 2024 |

I use the Hario switch to brew my coffee and am trying to reduce my caffeine consumption. Hence I would like to brew smaller cups of coffee. I am currently using 10g of coffee with 160g of water. (1:16 Ratio) I am wondering if there is a minimum amount of coffee...

Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

I used to wonder why my coffee was almost always sour. It seems other people have the same problem, so I just want to share my story, my frustration, and my happy discovery.

I'm also curious how other people learned the difference between sour vs stale? And what words you do you use to describe those flavors?

TL;DR- bought a good grinder, bought fresh roasted coffee. Learned that stale sour is different than under extracted sour. Also, old beans stale is different than old grounds stale.

For my home coffee, I used to grind finer and finer and brew hotter and hotter and still have problems with sourness… I was buying grocery store coffee, sometimes preground, and using a cheapo javapresse ceramic burr hand grinder. Also, I'm the only coffee drinker in the house, so it could take weeks or months to use up a bag.

Recently, I learned that what I thought was sour coffee was stale coffee. Under extracted sourness is different. It has a mouth puckering sour feel, not just a sour taste. I'm even thinking that roasted too long ago vs. ground too long ago staleness have different stale flavors.

My timeline of realization went like this: Early December- gifted a bag of roasted in October Intelligentsia beans, put them in the freezer knowing I would get a good grinder soon. Mid December- bought some specialty coffee locally about 5 days after it was roasted. Had the coffee shop grind it for me. I started keeping a journal of tasting notes and brewing methods.

That local coffee tasted a bit harsh for a day or two, then leveled off and was good, then lost its aroma, but tasted okay. This over a week or two. Then I got my 1ZPresso grinder and thawed out the Intelligentsia beans. They were good but just a touch ashy on the finish, if steeped too long. I mostly brewed those for the next couple weeks.

Then I busted the local coffee back out a couple days ago, so it was ground almost a month ago. No aroma to the grounds. Suuuuper sour coffee like I used to always make. Tastes like vegetables. Tastes I don't know, green? Undrinkable. Tossed it all out.

Went back to Intelligentsia, ashy/roasty flavour more evident. Tried a new aeropress recipe with much coarser grind. Totally different! Not as ashy, but…. sour. My mouth felt like I ate sour candy. So that's what sour means!

The beans that were roasted months ago tasted ashy-roasty-sour when fresh ground, the fresh roasted but ground weeks ago coffee tasted plant-sour, and the under extracted coffee tasted (and felt) sour candy sour. Only the last one had the notably different mouthfeel.

Maybe time past roast has more of an effect on purely internal/ time based chemical changes, while time past grinding has more of an effect on just oxidation type changes due to the increased surface area?

I'm starting to experiment and make bad coffee on purpose now. Too hot water, too cold, waaaaay too much coffee, or extreme grind sizes. I hope I learn more about defects this way, and I hope this story helps someone!

submitted by /u/Classy-J
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Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

Perfect Little Beans

Chinmey Hill Coffee uses specialty-grade beans with zero primary defects (such as black beans or sour beans) and less than five secondary defects (such as broken beans). This is important because primary defects will greatly affect the taste of the coffee. Having zero defects allows the coffee to be the most optimal flavor.

Window for Optimal Flavor

Chimney Hill Coffee ships our coffee the same day it was roasted, so you will receive it before it enters the window of optimal flavor.  This means you’ll never miss the opportunity to enjoy the coffee’s peak flavor.

Coffee Ratings

Coffee undergoes many scoring processes by professionals who achieved their Q Grader certification. Coffee is first graded when it’s green. If there are defects the coffee is determined to be “not-specialty grade”. For those coffees that pass green grading, they are sample roasted and cupped. (Cupping is the official term for critically tasting and scoring coffees. The official cupping form is standard worldwide, and where the 100-point scoring system comes from.) A coffee’s dry fragrance, wet aroma, flavor, aftertaste, body, acidity, balance, and overall impression are taken into consideration while uniformity issues and defects, will lower the overall score.

Specialty Coffee

Specialty coffee, coined by Erna Knutsen in 1974, refers to a coffee that receives a quality grading score of 80 percent or higher. While “premium” or “gourmet” seem like they’re synonymous with “specialty,” they simply are marketing terms with no defined standards. Specialty coffees are grown in specific and ideal micro-climates, and have distinctive and unique flavor profiles, with little to no defects.

Third-Wave Coffee

We’re currently in the third wave of coffee. The first wave of American coffee put pre-ground, vacuum-sealed cans in kitchens across America. The second wave started with the late ‘60s introduction of Peet’s coffee (by Alfred Peet) through the proliferation of Starbucks. The third wave of coffee focuses on origin transparency, nuanced flavors, and artisan roasting. The term “third wave” is synonymous with specialty coffee.

Sour vs stale, and different types of stale?

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